1984 633CSi Rises again!

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songzunhuang
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Thermostat cover replacement

Post by songzunhuang »

This is one of the easiest jobs I have ever done on this car. It took about 20-30 minutes and I was even able to collect the coolant and reuse it without issue.

I noticed during all my shenanigans with the Thermostat, that the neck of the various housings was corroded. Although they worked, they clearly had seen better days. This cover was the last piece to get replaced. Just about every part of my cooling system is now new.

On the old thermostat cover, you can see the corrosion that has happened on the hose neck. Although I could clamp the hose to get a good seal, it wasn't in the best shape and I wanted to complete the replacement of my cooling system.
The old vs the new.
The old vs the new.
ThermoCover.png (633.9 KiB) Viewed 8408 times
The new part is very well made. I must say that the casting and finishing work was top notch. In any case, this job took just two tools, a 10 mm socket wrench and a wrench for the hose clamp. That was it. Although it was tight quarters on the bottom, the top portion was simplicity itself. My cooling system should be good for years and years to come.
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1984 633CSi
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by zinnocoupe »

Nice work Song. I appreciate all the pics you include in your thread. If I wasn't so lazy I would do the same. Now that you have replaced the front sway bar links do you notice any difference. I have all those parts to install as well and wonder how much I'll notice. Cheers Dave
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by songzunhuang »

zinnocoupe wrote:Nice work Song. I appreciate all the pics you include in your thread. If I wasn't so lazy I would do the same. Now that you have replaced the front sway bar links do you notice any difference. I have all those parts to install as well and wonder how much I'll notice. Cheers Dave
Dave, not too noticeable yet. My old links were not loose, just the rubber was torn. I don't notice much change at this point. I do think my lower arms need replacing as well. They are weeping grease, but again no looseness. The joints are tight.

I do notice that the car has a tendency to drift right. I'll need an alignment, but I hate to waste money on that until after I replace the lower arms.

The biggest change to my car was definitely when I changed the springs and shocks. Ever since then, it's a different animal. With the new tires as well, it almost handles like a sports car. Almost.
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1984 633CSi
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Oh come on!

Post by songzunhuang »

I've been using my car as a daily commuter to the train station. I park it in the lot across the street from the platform. Although there are assorted issues, it's been serving me well. Today when I returned from work to commute home, I noticed that my antenna was in an odd position. Looking closely, it was clearly bent and it looked like someone tried to unscrew the base. When they could not remove the antenna, they decided to bend it and now my power antenna is ruined. I tried to bend it back, but it's hopeless.

Why is it that people do these kinds of things? Can't they just admire a well cared for old car and leave it be?
Now I have to get another antenna. This one is only 6 months old. Very annoying.
The formerly nice antenna on my car. It looks like I have to replace it again.
The formerly nice antenna on my car. It looks like I have to replace it again.
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Song Huang
1984 633CSi
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by slofut »

They weren't admiring your car, they were prob jealous that you had something and they didn't. Rather than get a real job, they screwed up your ant...
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by captain awesome »

That really sucks. I don't know why people can't understand if it's not yours and you don't have permission, DON'T TOUCH IT! I had a motorcycle stolen from me about this time last year and it was crushing. Still never found it, and it was more sentimental than a dollar value. I get angry just thinking about it.
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by hornhospital »

I'm not defending the scum that did that, but why was the antenna up? The power antenna is supposed to retract when you shut the car down, at least mine does.
Ken Kanne
'84 633CSi "Sylvia"; '85 635CSi "Katja";'85 325e "Hazel Ann"; '95 M3 "Ashlyn"
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by masonjones »

Ugh, sorry to hear that. That kind of stuff is so infuriating. I used to have a convertible and 2 weeks after putting a brand new top on it someone sliced a big hole in it. The car was unlocked so it was purely vandalism.
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by songzunhuang »

hornhospital wrote:I'm not defending the scum that did that, but why was the antenna up? The power antenna is supposed to retract when you shut the car down, at least mine does.
This was confusing because it was retracted. It looks like they tried to unscrew it from the base and when it wouldn't detach, they yanked it up and then bent it. The nut securing the base to the body was completely loose and the antenna was flopping around in the hole.

In any case, I have gotten an original Hirschmann antenna and I just need to find some time to change it again, Annoying as there's lots of other things that need attention and this wasn't on the list.

I just have to remind myself that it's just a material object and can be replaced. Yeah, that's it.
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by hornhospital »

Hmmmm, my Hirschmann mount sits much lower on/in the fender. The topper ball is very small, and withdraws into the base when retracted. :-k

(yes, the paint really is that bad. :( )
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Ken Kanne
'84 633CSi "Sylvia"; '85 635CSi "Katja";'85 325e "Hazel Ann"; '95 M3 "Ashlyn"
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by songzunhuang »

hornhospital wrote:Hmmmm, my Hirschmann mount sits much lower on/in the fender. The topper ball is very small, and withdraws into the base when retracted. :-k

(yes, the paint really is that bad. :( )
This wasn't an original antenna but an aftermarket universal antenna. I do have an original Hirschman now that I need to install, However, I do not think mine will be flush like yours. There will still be a bit of a protrusion, although not as pronounced as the one in the aftermarket replacement. I'll snap pics this weekend after I repair it.
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Song Huang
1984 633CSi
Last 7 of VIN: 6997383
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Original Antenna back on

Post by songzunhuang »

After my busted antenna incident, I've purchased a replacement OEM Hirschmann antenna shaft. I can't recall exactly how it was installed in the car, so I just did the best I could. I also used the rubber mount that I got from Ralph to get the original look.
Original OEM antenna back in the car.
Original OEM antenna back in the car.
OEM Antenna.png (973.05 KiB) Viewed 8213 times
The rubber mount ensures that the OEM look remains in place. Also, I must say that it's a LOT quieter than the aftermarket replacement I had before.
It's always nice to have the OEM look.
It's always nice to have the OEM look.
Installed.png (889.99 KiB) Viewed 8213 times
After the antenna replacement, I decided to attack the intermittent speedometer issue I've been having. It seems like there's a loose connection somewhere as tapping on the cluster will sometime bring it back to life. So for the - who knows how many times - I took apart the cluster again. I looked closely for any cold solder joints or any tarnished contact points. I found one. Here's hoping that everything works on my drive tomorrow.
Looks like it exploded. Here's the panel apart once again.
Looks like it exploded. Here's the panel apart once again.
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by miike87 »

As you got your cluster in parts already: check the capacitors in the instrumens. Two in the speedo and three in the revcounter (for the european M635).
Just took mine apart to address the shaking temp/fuel gauges. I found three blown ones...
M635 CSi 15.05.1984
Delivered: 199 Burgundrot, 159 Leather black, S2941A Kreuzspeiche, S401A SHD el., S510A headlight aiming, S664A Bavaria Electronic, S680A antenna man.
Today: 086 schwarz, BMW/BBS RC035/RC038, Bavaria C Electronic
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by masonjones »

miike87 wrote:As you got your cluster in parts already: check the capacitors in the instrumens. Two in the speedo and three in the revcounter (for the european M635).
Just took mine apart to address the shaking temp/fuel gauges. I found three blown ones...
Were the caps visibly blown? My speedo stopped working and the temp gauge sometimes pegs rapidly in time with the vehicle speed which is entertaining but probably not good for it.

I was planning to temporarily bypass my toasted SI board as described in this thread which is supposed to leave the instruments working: http://www.mye28.com/viewtopic.php?t=94937. While I'm in there I'll check the caps too.
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by songzunhuang »

miike87 wrote:As you got your cluster in parts already: check the capacitors in the instrumens. Two in the speedo and three in the revcounter (for the european M635).
Just took mine apart to address the shaking temp/fuel gauges. I found three blown ones...
It never occurred to me to check the capacitors. Any chance you can point me to some more detailed guidance? I've already go the panel back together and I am sorry to report that it's still wonky - definitely not repaired yet.
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by miike87 »

First of all: My spares should arrive today so I can fix it test it again.

These are just my personal findings. But it's likely that other clusters got the same problems.
If you take the odometer out of the rear white case and look inbetween the odometer and the PCB you can see the yellow cpacitor. This should normaly sit close to the PCB. If it's blwon it will lift from the PCB by 1-2 mm. The brown one is not visible blown but I'll replace it anyway. To get this done you need to unsolder 2+3 pins connecting gauge an odometer prior taking off the PCB. This may vary for miles and/or CAT cars.
Image

The rev counter was quite easy. If you take a look between the gauge and the rear case you can see the three brown capacitors.
2016-06-26 23.17.05.jpg
2016-06-26 23.17.05.jpg (285.51 KiB) Viewed 8155 times
The right two ones got small light brown strains and, if you take a closer look, got several cracks in the casing.
Image
To get these out you need to unsolder the gauge and take it off. Take care of the metal gauge and the thin shaft. I got no economy cauge so no idea what the lower part looks like.

In general you can expect all capacitors with cracked cases, bent tops or lifted from the PCB as blown. To be certain you need a special meter to check the characteristics. Due to heat and age capacitors tend to dry out and blow up. Widly known from early 2000s personal computers.
Hopefully i can repair everything tonight and give it a try. Additionally I'll take some more (and better...) pictures and write a small instruction how to fix this.
M635 CSi 15.05.1984
Delivered: 199 Burgundrot, 159 Leather black, S2941A Kreuzspeiche, S401A SHD el., S510A headlight aiming, S664A Bavaria Electronic, S680A antenna man.
Today: 086 schwarz, BMW/BBS RC035/RC038, Bavaria C Electronic
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by sansouci »

Song,
You may want to read this article by a guy who repairs high end audio equipment about capacitor selection
http://www.condoraudio.com/wp-content/u ... istors.pdf

I'm no EE so I cannot validate what he writes......


--Ken
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84 E24 633Csi Auto, Bronzit/PearlBeige 6997510
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by songzunhuang »

miike87 wrote:First of all: My spares should arrive today so I can fix it test it again.

These are just my personal findings. But it's likely that other clusters got the same problems.
If you take the odometer out of the rear white case and look inbetween the odometer and the PCB you can see the yellow cpacitor. This should normaly sit close to the PCB. If it's blwon it will lift from the PCB by 1-2 mm. The brown one is not visible blown but I'll replace it anyway. To get this done you need to unsolder 2+3 pins connecting gauge an odometer prior taking off the PCB. This may vary for miles and/or CAT cars.
Image

The rev counter was quite easy. If you take a look between the gauge and the rear case you can see the three brown capacitors.
2016-06-26 23.17.05.jpg
The right two ones got small light brown strains and, if you take a closer look, got several cracks in the casing.
Image
To get these out you need to unsolder the gauge and take it off. Take care of the metal gauge and the thin shaft. I got no economy cauge so no idea what the lower part looks like.

In general you can expect all capacitors with cracked cases, bent tops or lifted from the PCB as blown. To be certain you need a special meter to check the characteristics. Due to heat and age capacitors tend to dry out and blow up. Widly known from early 2000s personal computers.
Hopefully i can repair everything tonight and give it a try. Additionally I'll take some more (and better...) pictures and write a small instruction how to fix this.
Thank you for the details. I am looking forward to your follow on report. If it fixed the issues, then another luster disassembly may be in my future.

For now, I still have a few front end links, tie rods and my AC system to contend with.

Oh, and now my turn signal auto-return is not working. Arg...
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by hornhospital »

songzunhuang wrote:Oh, and now my turn signal auto-return is not working. Arg...
You didn't remove the wheel without turning the key to position 2, did you? I did that, once. That was enough. Snap, and the canceling nub was gone. #-o
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by miike87 »

First of all: It didn't solved my problem. It just got less shaking.

Technical background:
Capacitors start to dry over years. After 30+ years you can expect them to fail. The'll loose capacity, act like an short circuit or get an high impedancy. Everything leads to strange behaviour of your system. Most failed capacitors will blow up an d show strains of electrolyte on the outside or a bent case.
Broken capacitors will lead to instabilities and result in unexpected behaviour.

I did this on my '84 Euro M635. So no fuel economy gauge.
First you need to remove the odometer and the revcounter from the cluster.
The odometer ist held by four screews on the backside. On the PCB you need to unsolder 3+2 pins for the gauge and the odometer to take off the PCB. On the top side of the PCB you'll find two capacitors.
IMG_3364.jpg
IMG_3364.jpg (406.1 KiB) Viewed 8096 times
The yellow one clearly lifted off the PCB. It is rated 220µF/6V. It measured 86µF...
Replaced it by quality capacitors for same capacity but higher voltage rating due the required physical size. The new ones have to fit below the odometer.
IMG_3390.jpg
IMG_3390.jpg (515.27 KiB) Viewed 8096 times
In the revcounter you'll find three capacitors. To access these you need to unsolder the gauge, unscreew the front over and unscrew the gauge from the backside. Then you can take everything out. Take care not to bend the shaft. It is possible to take everything out without unsoldering the gauge but then you need to take extreme care of the shaft.
I replaced the three capacitors below rated 100µF/16V, 470µF/10V, 47µF/16V. The measured 0,025µF, 340µF, 48µF. So they were definitly worth a replacement.
You could clearly see the blown off electrolyte.
IMG_3365.jpg
IMG_3365.jpg (462.72 KiB) Viewed 8096 times
IMG_3367.jpg
IMG_3367.jpg (533.95 KiB) Viewed 8096 times
I hope I could clarify this topic. Feel free to ask if you need further information. I'll dig into the shaking gauges hopefully soon.
M635 CSi 15.05.1984
Delivered: 199 Burgundrot, 159 Leather black, S2941A Kreuzspeiche, S401A SHD el., S510A headlight aiming, S664A Bavaria Electronic, S680A antenna man.
Today: 086 schwarz, BMW/BBS RC035/RC038, Bavaria C Electronic
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by sansouci »

What are the rectangular yellow and green devices?
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93 E32 740il M60 Auto, Alpenweis/Ultramarine
60 528i M30 5-speed Green/Beige (crushed)
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by miike87 »

sansouci wrote:What are the rectangular yellow and green devices?
These are film capacitors. The won't fail normaly.
M635 CSi 15.05.1984
Delivered: 199 Burgundrot, 159 Leather black, S2941A Kreuzspeiche, S401A SHD el., S510A headlight aiming, S664A Bavaria Electronic, S680A antenna man.
Today: 086 schwarz, BMW/BBS RC035/RC038, Bavaria C Electronic
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Wonky Instruments continue - speedometer and fuel gauge

Post by songzunhuang »

Well, I've driven my car over 800 miles now and new behaviors have developed. My speedometer sometimes decides to stop working and then will magically spring back to life after a while. At other times, it'll have a reading, but it's only about 1/2 of the speed that I am really going. Over the last 4 tanks of gas, I've only ever had the trip odometer read around 200 miles. This is because the rest of the time, the speedometer (an odometer) are not working. I tried to take apart my speedo and check for cold solder joints and bad grounds, but I am finding nothing. I haven't tried the capacitor trick yet. No time.

Meanwhile an odd things has started to happen. My fuel gauge seems to be acting better after the new fuel level sender was installed. It still jumps around at times and I can make it wobble when I tap the front of the cluster. However, the last few times I filled it up the gauge and onboard computer was quite close. I basically get all paranoid when the onboard computer range is under 100 miles. Recall I was stranded when the gauge showed about 37 miles range still. In any case, my fuel gauge shows about 1/4 tank when the onboard computer shows 100 miles of range. When I fill my tank, it takes about 12 gallons. My understanding is that the car has a 16.6 gallon tank. So if it takes 12 gallons to fill, that means I have 4.6 gallons left in the tank. At about 21-22 miles per gallon that would be 96-101 miles. Wow, that's actually pretty close!

Three tanks now it's been pretty close. I guess the universe give and it takes. Now if I could just figure out the speedometer issue.
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Little things

Post by songzunhuang »

Well, the car is doing quite well mechanically. I'm commuting daily and with the weather getting cooler here, it's more bearable even though my A/C is less than optimal.

This weekend I finally got some time to do a few super minor things, but hey, it all adds up.

First up is the letters on the gear shift. I painted them. LOL!
Before and after. Now I can see the indicators. LOL!
Before and after. Now I can see the indicators. LOL!
Screen Shot 2016-08-02 at 9.28.49 PM.png (1.68 MiB) Viewed 7853 times
Then next was the tailpipes. They were so rusted and blackened. I took a wire brush to them and shined it up. Uh, yeah, that's all.
Hey, still makes a difference.
Hey, still makes a difference.
Screen Shot 2016-08-02 at 9.28.42 PM.png (1.11 MiB) Viewed 7853 times
I ordered an A/C gauge kit that should be here this week. I am going to attempt to evacuate and recharge my A/C.
Also, I have started to gather info for a complete A/C overhaul. One odd thing is that everyone seems to use the Sanden 508 type compressor. It has the high and low hoses attached in a "V" pattern on the rear of the compressor. Looking at mine, it nothing like that at all! Here's a picture where my high hose seems at attach at the middle of the compressor and the low hose somewhere near the front. As usual, this is going to be tricker than I thought.
My compressor is like none other. Front of car to right. You can see the clutch and belt.
My compressor is like none other. Front of car to right. You can see the clutch and belt.
Screen Shot 2016-08-02 at 9.28.16 PM.png (1.65 MiB) Viewed 7853 times
Anyone dealt with one of these?
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Song Huang
1984 633CSi
Last 7 of VIN: 6997383
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Re: 1984 633CSi Rises again!

Post by francoid »

I have not, but am very eager to hear how it goes for you :)
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